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/cyb/ - cyberpunk and cybersecurity

low life. high tech. anonymity. privacy. security.
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Help me fix this shit. https://archive.arisuchan.jp/q/res/2703.html#2703

Kalyx ######


File: 1530157782690.jpg (30.21 KB, 600x450, serveimage.jpg)

 No.2976

God I hate those people.

Cyberpunk has so much stuff going on. Androids (like really convincing ones, not that ugly mall robot that drowned itself in a fountain), Flying Cars, Off-World Colonies, VR where you could do soykaf, Brain Augmentations, whatever. Nothing of this exists today.

Still people share the same neon light illuminated ramen stall over and over and be like "cyberpunk is now look even my jacket has chinese on it". Does someone actually believe this shallow soykaf?

Of course I too like chinese cities at night. Spend my last holiday in Shanghai and it yes it looks like right out of bladerunner at times, but this is just one thing out of many while we're missing most others.

 No.2977

I know the reality doesn't look that cinematic, but I think it already started. It's not the ultimate dystopia, but some parts of it are already there. New generation is more dependent on the social media, yes they have the latest iPhone but they also have the latest mental disorder and they are highly dependent on legal/illegal drugs. Surprising amount of people now prefer porn to a real partner, in eastern Asia you have people that marry to their "waifu"s for real. Hacking is as much as a threat as good-old terrorism, robbery etc. Police and military have fucking drones. Environmentalists publish new warnings each day regarding planet Earth's health etc. etc. etc.

We are not there 100% yet, but it's only gonna get worse after this point. Just because we don't have cyborgs shoot lasers out of their eye sockets doesn't mean nothing is happening.

 No.2991

File: 1530203483381.jpg (352.97 KB, 961x961, showtime__work_in_progress….jpg)

>>2976
>CCTV everywhere
>human/object recognition AI
>unmanned aircraft armed with missiles
>self driving vehicles
>package delivery drones
>corporations trading user data
>social media networks manipulating public thought
>anonymous cryptocurrencies
>not cyberpunk

Cyberpunk is now whether you like it or not.

 No.2995

File: 1530241521640.jpg (42.1 KB, 300x300, Dead_Kennedys_-_Give_Me_Co….jpg)

If there's one thing cyberpunk fiction got wrong, it was how easy it is to put a shiny white cover on something, have a yorkshire man tell you it's your friend and have everyone choose to believe him. Megacorporations exist off buying, selling and editing our personalties. The world is literally being destroyed to fuel the largest egos in history. As I'm sure most of us know all too well, people fight hard to retain their ignorance because they are, in the short term, conveanced. Their brains and societies have been intentionally configured to make leaving things like facebook and google next to impossible. Cyberpunk is now.

>Flying Cars, Off-World Colonies

This isn't cyberpunk, it's sci-fi. Cyberpunk started in the recent past to tell stories about the near future.

 No.2996

>>2995
>Flying cars, off world colonies.

These are both likely refferencing bladerunner/do androids dream[…], both quite solidly /cyb/ at least by the canonical definitions I've been exposed to.

That said I certainly agree with your broader point. Those are vauge elements that hint of a future world, not actually elements of cyberpunk itself. If one house has carpet, that doesnt make all those with wooden floor something else–that quality is an irrelevant detail.

OP is probably itself making a mistake in over emphasizing aesthetics and under emphasizing other elements. So is the strawman it attacks, but thats beside the point.

I can see on many isuses the world is less /cyb/ than it could be. But I feel and will stand by the assertion that things have overlap with many cyberpunk themes–a cyberpunk book could have been written in the 70's about the world of today, with zero major changes.

Its naive to assume that in a cyberpunk world everything will be gritty, foggy, standing at the base of looming skyscrapers, who's antenna clad tops remain forever invisible, above the smog, and that everyone will be a razorgirl or a cowboy or whatever other archetypes you can pick. You could take the world of blade runner and use it as a setting for a romantic comedy in a sort of weird scifi setting.

 No.3002

File: 1530356873621.png (57.42 KB, 703x425, cyberpunk.png)

Cyberpunk is not an event. It is a process.

 No.3003

The levels of technology never mattered in cyberpunk as long as its high tech compared to the contemporary. Fucking Star Wars could be cyberpunk if you put out a story only taking place in the worst depths of Coruscant.High tech _low life_

 No.3005

If I remember correctly in the short story that coined the term the highest level of technology was online banking.

 No.3007

I'm reading Idoru by Gibson now and feel like stuff from his recent works is more likely to happen in 10-20 years. Older stuff like Neuromancer and GITS have that retro-futuristic feel to them and feel not so relevant in our consumerist society.

 No.3009

I know I'm stupid saying this on a cyberpunk board, but we need to move past cyberpunk, since we are now seeing that it's not really so great at doing what it set out to do, or at least it's less effective than it was as it become co-opted into the mainstream and watered down, but many problems were there from the beginning. I still love cyberpunk don't get me wrong, in fact I'd say it's my favorite genre of fiction, but not much has happened to it in the past few decades, it hasn't evolved well enough. It seems regressive at this point, when many people think "cyberpunk" they see 80s nostalgia rather than the future. So we need a post-cyberpunk. But sadly the genre of "post-cyberpunk" is mostly pretty rubbish aside from a few rare exceptions like psychopass. We need to collectively create a continuation / evolotion beyond cyberpunk that doesn't suck.

 No.3011

>>3009
What we need is blackened cybercrustpunk.

 No.3013

>>2976
Well there's the crowd that sees Cyberpunk as an aesthetic, but when people say "cyberpunk is now" I think they're more referring to the current state of technology and more often than not- surveillance issues as the ones >>2991 listed

 No.3014

>>2976
Cyberpunk is not only a dumb "muh flYinG caRs" stuff.
Like every kind of art movement, cyberpunk is not only a matter of aestetichs, but it's most importantly a matter of themes. What matters if they're normal cars or flying ones if the effect they have on society and the issues they underline are the same?
"The 120 Days of Sodom" by De Sade, written in 1785, and "Perfume" by Süskind, written in 1985, are set in the same time period and place. However, the themes they are most interested in, the writing styles and the stories they tell are completely different.
I've not seen "ready player one", but i've been told that even having VR and distopia, it's mainly a soykafty standart adventure film. At the same time, there are a bunch of episodes of Black Mirror than can be considered completely cyberpunk, even if they don't feature all of the things you listed.
Following your logic, even "A Scanner Darkly" by Philip Dick isn't cyberpunk, since it doesn't feature nor androids nor VR nor off-world colonies nor brain augmentation.
If the main themes are respected, everything else doesn't matter.
If people get their dopamine by wireheading or by internet porn, the result is the same.

Cyberpunk means alienation, paranoia, altered or uncertain reality, a society were the state doesn't take care of people and a culture based on edonistic nihilism, with all of those being achieved by technological progress, in particular concerning information technology.
Now, at least in the first world: society is slowly collapsing; robots are taking more and more of humans' work; everyone alienated af; everyone controlled; post-ideologic age, narcissism and individualism are the fundating values of our society; multinational enterprises make more money than governments; most of our primary (and even secondary) needs can be satisfied only with an internet connection and enough money, without the necessity of interacting with real people or going out.
The perfect example of this are companies like amazon and facebook, richer than states, with an absolutely tiny amount of human workers in them compared to their market size cause almost everything is made by robots and algorithms, their services push isolation, edonism and self-worshipping, they do mass-surveillance storing data of every fucking thing everyone of us does, they give us the possibility to satisfy our basic necessities like food&stuff (amazon), sex (porn), human interaction (facebook) with only a computer.
With this, plus the very fast development AI is having, the quantity of bots infesting the internet with kids watching algohoritm-generated cartoons on youtube, the fact that with drones even war isn't anymore made by humans, the spreading escapism that made videogames and antidepressives such a big thing in market terms, i can say that yes…

…cyberpunk is now.

 No.3017

I'd like to add another point that struck me while reading this thread. Remember how in Dicks's Electric Sheep novel, much more than in the Blade Runner movies, a huge part of the story is dedicated to the issue of animals disappearing and fake animals and insects.
Now, have you read all these recent reports and articles stating how bird and insect populations massively disappeared ? I've grown in the countryside, and when I was young, just sitting in the grass in the summer meant dozens of grasshoppers and various insects jumping and buzzing around, the whole thing under a birds concerto. Today, the nature, the gardens, the fields feel dead. It's harder to notice when something's gone, especially with the youngest that never knew this, but the nature is getting emptied by the massive use of pesticides mostly. Hell, I'm not even old, I'm 24, this was 15 years ago or something, and the rapidity of this extinction is really scary to me.

As it has been said earlier, cyberpunk isn't only foggy neon lighted cities under big skyscrapers. It's also deserted, lifeless countrysides, and the whole world more and more devoid of animal life.

 No.3018

>>3009
>We need to collectively create a continuation / evolotion beyond cyberpunk that doesn't suck.
This. Cyberpunk has to go DIY or go die. Otherwise it's just predictive programming that can tell you how to look cool in a dystopia, but not how to avoid it.

>>3014
>kids watching algohoritm-generated cartoons on youtube
Link? That's news to me.

>>3017
And there's been articles about robot bees and bullsoykaf like that. Don't worry guys, cyberpunk solves itself.

 No.3040

>>3009
All Science fiction wasn't co-opted, it was never what it seemed to be on the surface. If you look at the people publishing these works they all had incredibly deviant life styles and were looking for ways to justify them. "My character is a male AI trapped in a female body, it's so deep and insightful and just like me with my 12 sexualities" type of non-sense was shoved into everything.

One very important aspect of cyberpunk that people forget is the control of both sides of the fence. Trace back all the big revolution movements and you will find an alphabet agency engineering it in some way. These movements all had Huge amounts of power and central figures so you make sure those central figures are under your control and shift the people where you want them. This applies to the science fiction community just as much as it applies to the punk community or the sexual revolution. The powers that be saw the power in the information age and made sure there was a control system set up to steer the thoughts of those who would hold power in the future. Why try to convince every system's admin to be your bitch when they're old and have opinions formed when you can let them self indoctrinate on science fiction books they will willingly consume and pay you for? This is next level propaganda and it's ultra effective because you get to be both the counter culture and the mainstream at the same time. There is no other option but to consume the dystopian mind control, it just comes in two flavours.

We live in a cyberpunk Dystopia for sure. It's just that the writers you were reading weren't writing about the future dystopian state, they were implementing it from mind hacking you.

 No.3043

I live like a punk and I spend much time doing cyber things. Indeed, cyberpunk has come.

 No.3044

File: 1531335748957.png (499.01 KB, 423x767, 5a6d0c9917e324dbc768f40b18….png)


 No.3116

>>3044
I'd love to know more about the kind of processes that generate that garbage. Something somewhere is terribly wrong, but nobody seems to have more than guesswork as to what or why.

 No.3117

>>3116
AFAIK they just concatenate already existing videos.

 No.3137

>>3044
People have been pointing this issue out for years. I think this quote gives the most probable explaination for this phenomenon from a higher level systems perspective: "Automated reward systems like YouTube algorithms necessitate exploitation in the same way that capitalism necessitates exploitation"

 No.3138

>>3044
its good youtube is teaching kids femdom is the best fetish

 No.3141

Well, in a way we can never fully reach cyberpunk. The idea is always changing based on our current technology and our ideas of the future and aesthetics. The future always catches up with us so our ideas of it change. Like how the old astronaut idea of the space age circa 1955 is now almost laughable to us in the modern era. I guess its all about how you see it in the now. It has a great deal to do with the human perception of time, I suppose.

 No.3162

>>3137
Who is being exploited by a computer generated video on youtube?

 No.3166

>>3162

Children who can't understand any of the controls, and rely on autoplay to be fed their entertainment.

 No.3167

File: 1534542333052.jpg (25.32 KB, 397x470, m.jpg)

cyberpunk is very lame
real men go live in the woods

 No.3177

File: 1534668511433-0.jpg (12.11 KB, 300x225, lain_pc.jpg)

"Cyberpunk", as in the state of reality, is, in the late Mark Fisher's terms, a Lost Future. Much of the technology that's present in cyberpunk fiction is clearly supposed to be a direct progression of tech present in the 80s which clearly hasn't turned out to be the case. However, cyberpunk meaning the ethic of "high tech, low life" is absolutely present now which can be seen in the users of these sites, the revival of hacker culture etc. Viewing cyberpunk as purely an aesthetic concept doesn't really make much sense considering what has been born since the initial cyberpunk novels e.g. DIY-Bio (Grinders etc.), the continuing hacker culture, the increasing documentation on RCs and nootropics.

 No.3178

>>3167
Don't avatars defeat the purpose of an anonymous imageboard? It's no better than namefagging

 No.3180

>>3178

It is indeed, from an outsider perspective a way to better identify you. We do not recommend it at all.

As for cyberpunk it is a genre and also away of living for certain people but I feel the use of the word is losing meaning because it's use to talk about so many different thing and to express certain type art style or even music and it destroy the literal sense of the word.

 No.3181

>>3116
It's psyops to fuck with children's minds. There are all kinds of groups operating on the internet trying to manipulate others, even if they're just amateurs pushing some personal agenda.

 No.3185

>>3167
>Don't avatars defeat the purpose of an anonymous imageboard? It's no better than namefagging
>>3167
>We do not recommend it at all.
All true, please stop, because your posts are otherwise somewhat engaging and interesting, if not very measured.

>>3116
>It's psyops to fuck with children's minds.
>It's psyops to fuck with children.
Fixed it for you. Still kinda funny anyway.

 No.3381

>>3138
I think you mean gentle femdom

 No.3383

File: 1538438611677.jpg (49.33 KB, 598x480, best album.jpg)

Cyberpunk for me is slowly transforming my bedroom into a clusterfuck of servers and old computer, slowly replacing those 3rd party services with ones i deploy for myself and some close ones
And listening to pic related while admiring the temple i'm slowly creating

 No.3390

>>3383
What album is that? I can't read it from the image.

 No.3391

>>3383
God tier taste Alice.

>>3390
B-12 Time tourist, its on Youtube aswell.

 No.3392

>>3390
As >>3391 said, it's Time Tourist by B12
I'm looking for the physical version but that CD is pretty hard to find
I'd also recomend listeninig to Electro Soma I and II, also made by B12

 No.3393

Nobody ever said that cyberpunk was supposed to be "cool". It's rightly classified as dystopian. Our world does indeed share many of the dystopian aspects typically found in cyberpunk. I think that's what people generally are referring to. We are also very clearly approaching the point at which people are completely overrun by technology. How many people do you see who can even put down their phones for longer than a few minutes even?

 No.3424

>>3393

I don't think that it was supposed to be 'cool' either but it is clearly what people actually want or the world wouldn't be moving in that direction. So maybe instead of cool we could use the word 'desired' to describe how people feel about cyberpunk. We shouldn't make a value judgement on whether it is a good or bad thing, but instead we can judge based on if it is what people want to have happen or not.

 No.3429

File: 1539804201079.jpg (34.83 KB, 303x300, 51M 3 8QydL.jpg)

>>3392

Do yourself a favor & grab this too.

THD - Under A Statik Sky
Released in 1999

Total Harmonic Distortion

It's a cyberpunk classic. Introduced so many people to it & everyone has always been blown away.

I need to upload it to YouTube. Surprisingly no one has thrown it up yet.

 No.3430

Wow, if you think cyberpunk is about setting you need to go.
Low Life and High Tech it's right on the banner, you can be cyberpunk right now.
People like this are letting the government fuck us over. The world you aspire to see is not a world anyone should leave in as great as it is to fantasize over. Cyberpunks are preventing this world totalitarianism and corporate domination.

 No.3489

File: 1541462727628.jpg (44.99 KB, 233x178, cyberpunk-postcyberpunk.jpg)

You are fundamentally misunderstanding people who say that Cyberpunk Is Now. When this phrase is uttered it is rarely if ever within the context of a cyberpunk aesthetic, what people are usually referencing is the social relationships that define much cyberpunk literature.

I personally believe to have such a purely aesthetic understanding of cyberpunk is to not understand cyberpunk. Cyberpunk was a product of it's time and rarely if ever never accurately portray the future (or the now) at an aesthetic level. If i where you i'd go and read some post-cyberpunk, how the aesthetic changed to reflect the inevitable passage of time is one of the most interesting things about it, imho.

 No.3498

There is no cyberpunk.
Cyberpunk seems to mean some kind of underground resistance movement resisting some unspecified govcorp APT that one enters by "escaping the matrix" through going "deeper" into imageboards, darknets, various arcana. There is no deeper. The tor, imageboards, freenet contain no red pill. Darknet markets are an exciting relatively new phenomena on tor, but largely tor is empty of much beyond CP that doesn't exist on the clearnet. There is no underground on the internet.

The hacking skills everyone fantasizes about learning don't exist. Discovering 0day vulnerabilities is real, but difficult and time consuming, and 0days can have market values of tens of thousands of dollars. The vast majority of 'hacking' is done by exploiting users because modern operating systems have vastly improved anti-exploit mitigation systems (Carnaries on Stacks to prevent buffer overflows, Full ASLR, DEP, non-admin user tokens in unix forever (sudo) in Windows since 2007 ). APT1 actually used spearphishing campaigns to get into Google etc, In Operation Aurora. Second to that is exploiting misconfigured or way out of date auxillary systems (something pentesters specialize in - finding and exploiting forgotten systems). Finally, exploit kits with old 0days. The reality of of targeting successfully an APT with a real security budget is minimal, and if you had the ability to develop 50k USD vulnerabilities your probably sufficiently vested in status quo not to. Certainly near non of this expertise exists on imageboards, chans are famous for launching DDOSs not sophisticated attacks.

Some of the skills everyone fantasizes about exist outside labels of cyberpunk. Security communities exist. Programming Communities Exist. Martial Arts Communities exist. Soldiers and Mercenaries exist. It just turns out these people don't congregate under cyberpunk label, and the underground knowledge people expect to find isn't there.

The reality sucks. Its comparable to physics or math education. You learn how to solve a quadratic equation, and you think that solving cubics will be similiar, and are stunned to learn that analytic methods to solve equations degree 5 or higher just don't exist. You learn how to solve equations of motion with calculus and vectors, and you think you have just learned how to predict the motion of anything, until you realize virtually nothing is analytically solvable. Even as, thus with 'hacking'. Stuff you learn on hackthissite will not make you Edward Snowden.

 No.3549

>>2976
I think your issue stems from the fact you don't actually understand what cyberpunk is, and only draw your knowledge of it from limited popular culture references.

 No.3565

>>2996

Just came her tosay that i don't think Bladerunner is considered cyberpunk outside of internet types that don't really read and i've never heard PKD's work referred to as cyberpunk before, for what it's worth.

 No.3566

>>3565

With the exception of maybe A Scanner Darkly?

 No.3567

>>3498

Not necessarily true. I'll give you the benifit of the doubt and assume you havn't heard about IoT? You can spend an afternoon or a few days finding some 0day literally right now if you were so inclined. I found a vulnerability just yesterday with what? a cursory 15 minute poke around on a piece of hardware? As an exercise go to 0day.today and see how trivial a lot of these 'sploits are. Lots of modern devices don't use ASLR, PIE, Canary, etc. that you speak of but even if they did it isn't like there arn't well documented work arounds.

 No.3568

File: 1542929062379.jpg (301.84 KB, 1000x667, tokyo-left.jpg)

Personally wasn't around for the inception of arisuchan or the culture that gave birth to it or lainchan but came to it from other chanchans just generally searching through information, not hidden information, not esoteric information, just human information. I've always lurked on boards just watching people do their thing and sort've wondered at it just because it's interesting seeing people do things. It beats social media stalking honestly but you can take a lot of artistic leads from the aesthetic you can find only on these boards. It's a culture. I feel like what everyone is getting at is that cyber punk means something different to everyone else being more of a catch all or umbrella term. Take ghost in the shell cyber punk and then compare that to blade runner cyber punk or even akira cyber punk and it never aligns. That being said one could say cyber punk is now, just technically speaking, but the usage of the word cyber punk at least on this image board comes from anime or more general futuristic novelizations or films in which you have a character lost within a vast network of urban and technological landscape and development. I actually think that's the key component missing from calling our world a cyber punk one. Mega cities do exist but they're not to the extent to which you'd imagine cyber punk unless you're in Hong Kong or Tokyo or the like. At the same time that also encompasses the "cyberpunk" atmosphere of neon everything but again that's just getting further into individual subjectivity. Can New York be said to have cyber punk atmosphere. BUT to the point we're never completely lost in the landscapes we inhabit even if we do live in mega cities. You cant really disappear completely. I mean you can it's just not in the sense that you'll be able to get away with having a biker gang blow up cars in Tokyo 3.

Really i'd say cyber punk wont ever exist because i don't like you and i want your dreams to die but it's more to the point that we're at the beginning of some transitional shift in how human beings live in a service economy and that generally requires the increase in the size of cities. That may be wrong but It's like the beginning to the building of an ant column. It's boring at first and becomes less so until it's not. As far as technology goes I think wider spread adaptation of programming would do it. The one time I did feel that feel it it was a pretty good feeling, but I had this thing called hondata and hooked it up from a civic to my laptop. That's my cyber punk though.

 No.3569

>>3177
agreed

 No.3571

>>3011
poisonous venom punk

 No.3579

>>2976
I get excited about the future though I feel those technologies are way off. Most of them anyway.

 No.3582

But cyberpunk is now.
Cyberpunk is not androids, flying cars or off world colonies. Cyberpunk is invigalation, megacorporations, it's social problems, it's psychological problems, it's philosiphical problems etc. You are thinking about sci-fi, and cyberpunk is not just any sci-fi, it's much more.



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